“Seth material” search engine (Jane Roberts)

(At 8:40 PM Jane lay down for a brief rest, while I sat quietly in an attempt to use psychological time. I experienced nothing untoward; Jane however got the thought of dream locations taking up no space. I called her at 8:55. She felt somewhat relaxed, she said, and not as nervous.

I am pleased that you are so pleased with our last session. I was in fact going to speak about dream locations, in that you definitely experience these locations in your dreams, which take up no room in your space.

On one level they could be said not to exist, and yet they do exist. While in your dream, you are able to see and touch and move about in these locations. It is only when you awake that they escape you. This should be considered along with our material on the expanding universe, since dream locations represent, certainly, a reality, even a framework that has no existence in your space; and measured purely along the lines used to measure your space, you would receive no hint at all of their existence or reality. Measured purely in terms of your camouflage conceptions, many things which you know to exist would seem not to exist.

You cannot deny your own psychological reality, but sometimes it seems as if you would if you could. You cannot feel outwardly, or see or measure, an emotion, and an emotion takes up no space. Emotions still exist. Feelings intensify. In value they can be said to expand, yet this very real intensity or value expansion of a feeling takes up no more additional space than it did at its conception.

The color red is more vivid than the color black, using black here as color. However red takes up no more space than black. In other words expansion, occurring in terms of value quality, or gradations of intensity, has nothing to do with expansion in space. And expansion of value and intensity is the only real form of expansion.

I have said that the mind cannot be detected by your instruments at present. The mind does not take up space, and yet the mind is the value that gives power to the brain. The mind expands continually, both in individual terms and in terms of the species as a whole, and yet the mind takes up neither more nor less space, whether it be the mind of a flea or a man.

The mind simply does not exist in spatial terms. You have no way of measuring the mind’s expansion, any more than you can measure the expansion of the universe as long as you are thinking in terms of expansion in space. To deny the reality of what does not exist in space would be to deny much of mankind’s own heritage and abilities.

Again, the dream world exists in a very personal, vivid and valid manner, but the dream world does not take up so many inches or feet or yards or acres. Now we get into something else. If the dream world exists, and it does, and if it does not exist in space, then in what, or where, does it have its existence, and what paths if any will lead us to it?

Since I have also said that basically the universe has no more to do with space in your terms than does the dream world, you may deduce a similarity between the medium in which both the basic universe and the dream world may be found. You must understand here that your idea of space is something quite different from the reality of our fifth dimensional space. I want to make this plain again before we continue.

Your idea of space is some completely erroneous conception of an emptiness to be filled. Things, planets, stars, nebulae, come into being in this universe of yours. They are born continually according to your latest theories, and this universe expands—pushed, so to speak, so that its sides bulge, the outer galaxies literally bursting out into nowhere. True fifth-dimensional space, as I have said often, is to the contrary vital energy, itself alive, possessing endless abilities of transformation, forming all existences, forming even the camouflage universe with which you are familiar, and which you attempt to probe so ineffectively.

This fifth dimensional space, this basic universe of reality of which I speak, expands constantly in terms of intensity and quality and value, in a way that has nothing to do with your idea of space.

The basic inner universe beneath all camouflage does not have an existence in space at all, as you envision it. Space as you envision it, that is as an emptiness to be filled, is a camouflage.

If the dream world and the mind and the inner universe do exist, and if they do not exist in space, and if they do not exist basically in time, though they may be glimpsed through time, then your question will be: in what medium or in what manner do they exist; and without time how can they be said to exist in duration?

You already have many clues that I have given you. The answer itself should not seem unbelievable. You know for a fact that dreams exist. You know that the mind exists, you have personal intimate direct knowledge of these. I am telling you that the basic universe exists behind all camouflage universes in the same manner, and taking up no space, that the mind exists behind the brain.

The brain is a camouflage pattern. It takes up space. It exists in time. The mind takes up no space, it does not have its basic existence in time. The reality of the inner universe does not take up space, nor does it have its basic existence in time. Your camouflage universe, on the other hand, takes up space and has an existence in time, but it is not the real and basic universe, any more than the brain is the mind.

Now nevertheless the dream world, the mind and the reality universe do exist. They exist in a climate that we will call the value climate of psychological reality. This is the medium. This takes the place of what you call space. This value climate of psychological reality is a quality which makes all existences and consciousness possible. It is one of the most powerful principles behind or within the vitality that itself composes from itself all other phenomena.

Growth in your camouflage universe often involves the taking up of more space. Actually in our inner universe of reality growth exists in terms of the value or quality expansion of which I have spoken, and does not, I repeat, does not imply any sort of space expansion. Nor does it imply, as growth does in your camouflage universe, a sort of projection into time.

What you consider death has no more basic reality than has your idea of time and space. Death really represents a blind spot in your present ability to perceive energy transformation, and even value fulfillment. Death merely represents the termination of your own perception, that is, the termination of your understanding. Your ability here amounts to a complete dwindling of comprehension. Your senses are not equipped to perceive the transformation of energy from one form to another.

Remember however our universe that fulfills itself yet takes up no space, and our imaginary painting in which distance appears ever further in the background, while never touching the back of the painting, and this may give you some intuitive understanding of our spacious present that has duration, and yet takes up no space.