“Seth material” search engine (Jane Roberts)

The meeting with your Seagull friend was significant for many reasons. Symbolically, Seven (Oversoul) was important because the book showed Ruburt the wedding of psychic ability and creative ability, emerging as fiction and art form, and his baby.

The connection between the two was securely made. The meeting with your Seagull friend however also helped cement this realization on his part. The acceptance from another writer, simply on that level alone, was important: But the meeting with someone who also shared psychic and writing ability was vital.

His reading for Richard was also symbolic. It represented the acceptance by another writer of his psychic abilities as well as himself.

He did therefore develop a strong conscientious self, so that these abilities would be put to good purposes, and not frittered away. Until he was absolutely certain that he was on the right track, he would hold back, as indeed he has—but only to a certain degree, as indeed he has.

It is therefore no coincidence that Richard was a student of Nebene’s, and the material on the reincarnational aspects (that Jane gave in ESP class last night) is quite correct. In so helping Ruburt, he (Richard) is also paying back a service to Nebene, for he owed him much.

I will very shortly now be involved in our new book, and with Ruburt’s consent: and Richard’s visit, or one of other probable events like it, was to occur before the book continued.

As Nebene, while attracted by Ruburt, and in love with her, you considered her evil, and your attraction to her as a weakness on your part, a debasement: so now you find yourself in the position of helping Ruburt understand that his basic nature is good, that he is not leading people astray, as in that life you thought he was.

At the same time, the existence of the Nebene characteristics served to bring to your attention the Josef characteristics. Nebene to some extent then was a trigger of creativity. The realization of Nebene would automatically lead you to question, to bring to your conscious attention characteristics that otherwise you may not have recognized; blocks to your creativity, and yet strong drives toward the nature of truth, from which your creativity also springs.

For Nebene’s being was deeply involved with the search for truth. Nebene’s students are also coming back to say hello—

He was at one time possessed of a great desire for power, and led, in those terms now, many astray. It is for that reason that he so fears the false prophet idea. Give us a moment. Is your hand tired?

This was when he was a male in Turkey, as the country has been called, and you were his cohort, as in the dream he had. There were two Turkish lives, one after another. He was a great leader, driven by the desire for power, and by a sense of purpose, in the Ottoman Empire. He wanted to conquer, and bring the world under Ottoman sway.

He used the sword—another reason, incidentally, why he does not want to hurt anyone now—and the magic of words, and was involved in wars against Christendom. He knew Pete (Stersky, a member of Jane’s ESP class) who was then a dancer, a woman.

The two of you were exceedingly close in male comradeship—far more intense than any known now in your time. In your terms he was—in your terms from this standpoint—he was a fanatic against the Christians for religious, political and economic reasons. He feared Rome and hated it. It was no coincidence that Father Traynor used to read Don Juan of Austria (in the Catholic Church the young Jane attended), for they knew each other at that time.

Ruburt demanded utmost obedience. He lived for the cause. Many were killed upon his word. His sense of energy was boundless, and he was convinced of his purpose. Toward the end of a long life, however, he began to doubt. Life was cheap. Give us a moment.

I am not sure, here, if the word is Tartar. You were with him, but because of personal loyalty to him and the brothership of male with male was considered sacred—but you became appalled that he was leading his people into destruction.

He determined then to keep this power to sway people in line, until, if ever, he was sure of his cause. He led armies, then, and to what end, he thought. It was in that life also that he knew Sue as the personality that sometimes has emerged between them.

Now this is one of the reasons why he was so worried in this life, about leading people away from Christendom, for he did it before.

In the first of those two lives, both of you to some extent tried to enforce your ideas of truth through force, physically. The use of great physical force therefore was used purposely. You were involved with your ideas of truth in an entirely different context, as was much of Europe at that time, and some of the world now.

You were not that out of keeping with your times, then. The whole world, more or less, was experimenting with the use of brutal force as an accepted method of enforcing ideas. Anything else was the exception. There are other connections with this life, in which Ruburt chose a woman for his mother who was helpless. Not only could he not attack her, but he was in a position where he must serve her.

Now the woman who was his mother this time had a connection with another leader—I am trying not to get distortions in here; you may have to check some of this later—I believe Charlemagne, and Ruburt slew him in battle, after he was first crippled. The two were bitter adversaries. Ruburt put himself in a position therefore where violence could not be used.

It was then, when Ruburt found himself at all close to a position of any importance, that he came into difficulties, because people would begin listening to him again, and he had to be sure his message was a true one.

The personality however, tell him, lived according to his lights, possessed a primitive love of nature, and did, now, inspire others with heroism under the conditions chosen In the second existence mentioned, he was again a leader, but had learned the two-tongued nature of power, and allowed the Christians to win. In a way he handed that burden over to them. They had to grapple with it, and for several centuries.

Had they not, the history of the world as you know it would have been quite different. The Ottoman Empire ended up stripped of its power then on purpose, where the deceiving nature of power was given to Christendom, and in this our friend saved his people from a probable future in which the unsavory aspects of power predominated for them.

He took the temptation away. I have a small point here, in that Hitler represented as a bleedthrough from a probable reality—extremely interesting. He was a personality who literally should have been born back in those eras, and was not. In one respect he was like a time projection, appearing out of place, a psychological warp brought into displacement by a phenomena that psychologically could be likened to a natural phenomena like a volcano.

As an analogy, most events are this high. (Jane held up her cigarette lighter.) The events in the times of the Crusades, for example, were this high. (Jane raised an arm over her head, full length.) Following the analogy the times, the physical times in which they would ordinarily have occurred, would have ended, say, here—(Jane indicated a spot six inches above the lighter)—but the energy was so great that it catapulted some of these events, displacing what you think of as time, so that they appeared, as Hitler did, where theoretically, now, they should not have.

Yet his emergence was important, reminding the race of the perils into which it could indeed fall. In many respects however Hitler was not a complete personality in usual terms. Part of his vitality and what would have been his redeeming qualities, were sunken in the past in which he did not exist.

All of those involved in the Ottoman Empire had their reasons therefore, tell Ruburt, and the victims acquiesced to the basic assumptions of the time, as much as you and Ruburt did. The energy released was fantastic. It also involved the opening of many channels through which sheer vitality was made accessible and served as an impetus against which man could judge his progress.

There was an unabashed joy with the splendor of the body, and sensuous delight, that Ruburt can now remind himself of, and that served to help regenerate at least portions of Christendom that were given to ideals of bodily denial.

The Ottoman Empire’s death in its own way regenerated Europe, and its energy gave birth to the civilization that you know. The death of the Ottoman Empire enriched Europe. The pagan “Joy of life” in its own way sparked new blood. Christendom would have died out otherwise, for it was already tired. Unwittingly therefore Ruburt aided the growth of Christendom as it became known.

(11:17. This was actually the end of the session. While talking Jane had images in trance that she couldn’t describe now, concerning Hitler and displacements “shooting out” of their times, etc.