“Seth material” search engine (Jane Roberts)

([Ron:] “Yes, but I don’t necessarily agree with the logic of your answers.”)

There is no destruction and there is no evil. But while you believe that there is, then you must act accordingly. While you believe that to murder a man is to destroy his consciousness forever, then you cannot murder, and in your terms it is an evil.

([Ron:] “Are there instances in which a spirit from another reality would intervene in this reality, and we would call that a destructive act, but the spirit would say it was creative?”)

Not. (Pause) I do not like your term. Now. Any such intervention would only occur on the part of a personality who was, for the present time, physical. As indeed mentioned last week, the villain in a religious drama would be a creative figure. But he would exist historically in your time and not, for example, be a ghost whispering in the night. There are no creatures whispering evil in your ear.

(Ron:] “But in the terms that we are all spirits acting out our own inner drama, the term spirit has some meaning?”)

Sometimes, but only occasionally, I think you are catching on.

No! There are no forces outside of yourselves that in your terms cause you to do evil. Unfortunately, what you think of as good and evil reside within yourselves, and you cannot blame an evil force for the destruction that runs rampant across the earth. Again, in your terms, these are your problems, and no god or devil put them upon you, and there is no one to blame but yourselves. On the other hand, for the seasons and the idiot flower (looks at Joel H.), you have yourselves to thank. You are learning how to use the creative energy of which you are a part, and you are indeed quite isolated, so you cannot do much harm, in your terms. And so that the evil that you think you do is an illusion. And so that for the millions that you think you slay, you slay not one. And so that despite you and your concepts of value, creativity always emerges triumphant, and those that are killed in one war come back to fight against war the next time, and hopefully, you teach yourselves some lessons. And if you destroy your planet, you will have others to work with, and those that were destroyed are not destroyed. You are in a training system. The mistakes in the long run, and in your terms, will not count, but they are very real to you at this time.

I had two illegitimate children (laughter), a mistress that sneaked into my private studies, a magician that I kept in case I did not do too well on my own, a housekeeper who was pregnant every year that I had her, and three daughters who joined a nunnery because I would not have them, and I am referred to in barely three paltry lines, for my reign did not last very long. Now, I had a large family, that is, I came from a large family. And I was ambitious, as all intelligent young men of that time were. I did not go for the military, and so there was nothing to do but go to the Church.

Now. For a while I was not in Rome, but held my religious call elsewhere. I wrote two Church laws. It should all go to show you that some good ends up from everything. I died of trouble with my stomach because I was such a glutton. My name was not Clement (to Theodore), though Clement is a lovely name. I was originally called Protonius. Now give me a moment. The last name is not nearly so clear, and this is not my papal name, but my, if you will forgive the term, common name. Meglemanius. The third. From a small village. Unless I summon the self that I was at that time, the memories for details are not that clear. But as I now recall them, without directly checking on our friend the pope, who has, you must understand, gone his own way, I am coming as close as I can. We did not have as many guards at that time, but we had many stolen paintings and jewels of great merit. Now some of these jewels, as well as the money, went for expeditions that you do not realize were adopted at that time, having to do with commerce and ships sent through Africa, and this interest had to do with my later life when I was involved with the oregano. My sniffing goes back for centuries.

I was very fond of my first mistress, whose name was Maria. And there were no such sane rules as those in which you now sit. And there were no governments as secure in which you could reside as those you now enjoy. I did believe implicitly in the God in which I was brought up, and in that belief. It was only later that I wondered how such a God would choose me for such a position and then I began to wonder. I had four lives following that of the most adverse circumstances to make sure that I understood the difference between luxury and poverty, pride and compassion. And there were days that I walked in other centuries the same streets that I had walked as a pope, but then only put my fancy toes abruptly upon and lifted them up again. But as a peasant I walked with a heavy foot and great weight until I learned the lessons that I had to learn, as all of you will learn your own lessons.

(To Brady.) And you will be a guest, if you do not mind cavorting with past popes. I know it is against your principles, but then it is against my own (laughter). A past pope is better than a present one.